Hi PR:

To the best of my knowledge there is no server or web site currently set up to host a video tournament but it would be great if you and I could make this happen. Hopefully Gavin would have no problem running a tournament server which allows 2 players to play uninterupted while we stream the feeds from our sides to the spectator web site.

Anxiously Awaiting a True Warrior,

Rommel

Uh, thats easy, Richie already streams his web cam to his web site.

Both. The point was that the fix for players that appear to intentionally disconnect didn't fix anything.

Real time streaming would not be advisable as it would allow the other player to look over your sholder before the shots are made.What I was hoping for was an officially set up and maintained tournament option that ensured that an honest game was played by both parties.

Then add a password for the site and only give it to the observer.
Besides, I doubt there would be enough detail in a webcam recording a screen image to be able to see angles and power very clearly.

Oh jolly,a duel!!!

Hi Peanut's Revenge:

I'm not sure who came up with this idea for the Christmas tournament but it didn't get any support. I believe that you are sincere and hope that we can get enough players interested in supportting this to make it a reality. The real time option would display the buy screen and with it being almost full screen, it might be easy to read. A delay would prevent the contestants from looking over each other's sholders and also prevent spectators from giving advise to the competitors during the game. A delay will not provide any protection from advise given later though.

It disturbs me that none of the so-called and self-proclaimed masters have tried to get this going but perhaps they have something to hide. If there is anyone out there that would like a video tournament option, please speak up. Although I am still not convinced that preventing aimbots isn't possible, I am convinced that verification of honest shooting is certainly possible using video cameras.

Is there anybody out there?
Just smile if you can hear me.
Is there anyone at home?

I hope to hog you soon,

Rommel

It was myself that came up with the idea of recording games, which could then be edited by someone good (my suggestion was the legondary DireWolf), which could then be made into a torrent that we could all seed to help the community (a little something from those of us that can't/won't donate). A recording of the final as a testiment of the game, so to speak.

That was my primary reason, but I did that it could also clear peoples names from accusionation of cheating.

I think a delay of 10-15 seconds would be hard to achieve, its to common for people to want to intentionally delay a live feed, the goal is usually to minimise delays.


Infact, now I come to think of it, that would be a brilliant addition to the game.
In call of duty 4 (thats the most upto date game I have played in a long time) on many servers, when you die, you get to see the other persons view, when they saw you, aimed and shot, usually about seconds of footage.
If that was added to the game, say, the full shot time was shown to you of your killer, it might take away cheaters and help teach people about aiming (newbs watching pros line up a shot).
I'm not sure about how much coding, but I think that could be very achievable and rewarding.

Altough i like the idea of a one on one server and video feed for spectators it wont make it impossible to cheat.

When will the duel commence?

If the video is of sufficient quality and the subject is properly framed, how could anyone cheat?


From what I've come to understand about aiming aids, ALL OF THEM, is that they would be very obvious to a spectator that was in the same room with the shooter. Perhaps you have forgotten about the little video I made of my legendary shooting prowess. If so, take another look and see if you think I could have possibly used anything other than my eyes and brain to make those incredibly fantanstic shots.

After getting barraged by several players, I was heavily damaged and had to change my angle and power to make the kill on the next shot. Note, if you will, how much time I devote to aiming versus how much time I spend being goofy while waiting on the others to fire.

My first shot ... Looks like it took about 5 seconds or so. Due to starting the video and making my introduction, the timer started flashing just as I started to aim. Why do the "best" players seem to always need all of the time to make their shots? Because they are using a shooting aid is my guess. If an old geezer can make decent shots in less than 30 seconds, then surely the shot clock can be shortend to 25 or 30 seconds without upsetting anyone that plays honestly.

When ? Beats me but I think it's a superb idea. I know the quality is poor on the video I did but I don't have a web cam and had to use a digital still camera that has an avi video option. However, I'll happily purchase a web cam if we can get this video tournament option off the ground.

My video camera does a better job than the still camera but converting the film footage would be prettty time intensive I think. What would be the best web cam to use considering that picture quality is much more critical than the bandwith for what we want to do?

I suppose I could tape a challange and mail the tape to the loser, but the last time I mailed a package to the U.K. with tracability, it cost me about $ 50.00 U.S. thus a tape swap doesn't seem feasible.

Oh yeah, before I go, has anyone tried having a grid tattoed on the inside of their eyelids? If this video option gets off the ground, it might be the only way to get an assist without getting caught. Of course I'll be watching for rapid eye blinks and overly bright monitor screens.

I wouldnt say I was a top player, but would certainly say that I am an accumplished player and I usually take the full time limit to make my 1st shot on a player, with subsequent adjustments taking much less time.
Come to think of it, it's usually just the 1st shot of a round that takes the most time as after that I have a fair idea of what the wind is doing (even when completely changing angle).

I do not know wtf you are talking about that 'aiming aids' will make a shot require more time than going by eye.

My belief is that the software would do what yusuf pranked people with the other week, would consist of a line showing the exact path the shot will take.
If anyone has played snooker /pool games on computer there is often an option to show the shot line, how the cue ball will come off the target ball and how that ball will react. I believe thats how the bots work on here.
With that in mind, surely the shot time required will be alot less as can just point camera at your target and adjust until the end of the line is on your target (or ground near your target if hiding the bot use).

Rommel, with all due respect (which lately has been decreasing at a horrendous level given how much respect I used to have for you), your aiming is not upto the majority of the resular players here, so saying how long you take to make a shot has even less relevance than the usual 'we are all different and so take different lengths of time'. POM for example is a very quick shot maker and has the kind of accuracy expected from a regular player. I take a lot longer with a similar accuracy.

For regular games, I do not believe that a real time video feed would be good at all, players will be able to see who is targetting them, what weapon they are using, how many batts they have, what weapons they have etc...
For a 1v1 I think its very do-able, providing the bottom of the screen is not visable (or wherever people put their widgets (or whatever they are called) as we already know who the person will be targetting. The only exception would be a tele position where a player would easily know that one is being used and not to waste a decent weapon.

My original suggestion about recording tornament activities was for it to be recorded locally and then edited into a mixed video for post-tourney viewing.

BTW, the recording doesnt have to be streamed to anyone for a 1v1 battle to show that no cheating was done. Could just record your match then upload to those who wish to view it and confirm that it WAS the match and that there was nothing strange heppening.

To get back to the reason this has topic has arisen, Rom, I do not believe that you do/would cheat at this game and I hope that I have your trust that I am an honest player too.
So if you still want that 1 v 1 with me, I am happy to just jump on a server that either you or I setup (the mcb server would be no good due to the bots and others joining) without having to prove no cheating was involved.
Maybe ask an admin we both trust to spectate who is kinna trained to spot a cheat/suspect player to either point such a thing out or just be a neutral person to verify / dismiss any allergations and scores.

And breathe

A video feed would be a great addition to scorched ,altough im not technically that great i assume it would take a lot of effort to make it work properly.Are there any games that use something like that at all?
If there was a just a spectator view to look at individual players i guess it would be easier to do,but would do little to catch cheaters who know what they are doing.The videofeed would be harder to cheat but with enough effort and knowledge it should be possible to have an applet running on a second monitor out of sight.
Altough it would make it merely harder imo it would probably make it hard enough to make cheating not worth the effort.
So if it can be done,i welcome our big brother to keep an eye on indecent behaviour.No more naked games

The details on the time it takes to aim using the known aimbots, given the various wind and terrian, have not been publicly revealed. However, some rather notorius shooters have told me that they need more than 30 seconds in order to dead head someone with the first shot, in every round. They also said that the short shot clock was a good deterent to assisted shooters.

Note: Assisted Shooter - A player that uses ANYTHING other than the information presented on the screen, their eyes and their brain to plan a shot. By definition, all cheaters are assisted shooters but not all assisted shooters are cheaters.

The numerous forum posts I have read on this subject indicate that assisted shooting is allowed as long as the original source code is not altered and used to gain an advantage. I'm fine with this as the policy for the official servers and don't kick up a fuss about gettng killed from across the board with the first shot when I play there. However, I am still very much interested in finding a way to ensure that those of us that would enjoy an honest battle of wits on another server have a way to ensure the wits.

As you know, I thought your idea for the Christmas tournament was great and I hope that we can work out the details so that future tournaments will be able to use it. Simply making video challanges won't eliminate assisted shooting but it might make better players out of those that chose to participate. It seems that so far, you and I are the only ones interested.



We can speculate on anything but as you Brits like to say, the proof is in the pudding. You may remember the post I made asking someone to capture an aimbot in action and to post the video or photos. Those that use such things certainly couldn't be expected to reveal themselves but I did expect that we would be supplied with all of the details so that we would be able to spot it as easily as some have claimed it can be spotted.

My hypothesis, based on the limited amount of information that I have recieved is that the aimbot that was revealed, required a series of test shots to hit the mark. You manually enter your angle and power and fire a test shot. Then adjust and fire again, repeating this until until you get the shot where you want it. Then you turn off the bot and using the same numbers, fire the real shot. If this is true, then the ability to fire several test shots might be seriously limited with a short shot clock. Also, I have no idea if the shot is plotted instantly or if the shot takes several seconds to be plotted.



Jeepers PR, I didn't know that self dirting to keep you from killing me bothered you so much. If I get a chance, I'll dirt you and hog you instead. As for my aiming, twenty five seconds is adaquate for me and as you said I'm not upto the majority of the regular players here.



Agreed, and to the best of my recollection, no one suggested video for anything other than tournaments or 1 on 1 challanges. You miss the point of the video if you think the sceen is all you need to see. You can't tell what the player is doing unless you see the player as well.



Hmmmmm, seems I shot at you a few days ago and missed. IF I MISS YOU MUST BE CHEATING! Sorry xtc, I coudn't resist. You? Of course not, but if you are, you need more practice. Personaly, I think it is silly to trust anyone to be honest indefinately without the means to occasionally do an audit. Since the game provides no means to ensure honesty, the video challange option seems to be a decent way for the admins to do an occassional audit. Of course you are correct about the timing. Sending the videos to a web site where the interested parties can view them should be fine if the detail is sufficient. The live cam option would allow an official observer in a tournament to ask the particiapants to change the camera angle, lean back a little, put the notes away, etc..



Sounds good to me except for the proof. I'll get a webcam and make a sample video. You do the same. If we can both agree that we can see what we need to see from the samples, we can be the first to give this a go.

Bandwidth not being an issue, which webcam has the best resolution and depth of field?

Hoping to hog you soon.

Firstly, which I meant to mention earlier, your camcorder (should it have a UCB/Firewall connection) should be able to stream video just like a web cam but with far greater clarity and fps.

Secondly, the player need not be in the picture, just the screen, that way you can see if rulers are being used or turning terrain/water off etc..

If someone makes notes of their power, so what? Some people have a bad memory and problems with numbers...

glad to see you guys could find somewhere to square off. I thought maybe we would get replies on the whole scoring thing but if this is where you have to challenge eachother so be it. I would also love to see some ppl on camera playing if not for anything else to see the different styles. I don't think I can do the whole streaming thing since my webcam is on my laptop and would always be facing me. I could maybe buy a cheap one from wallie world but would have no idea how to make it stream video on line while playing without getting kicked. Not like anyone would suspect me of cheating anyway LOL!