This topic contains 14 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  Stil8 9 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #6507

    Stil8
    Participant

    😯 😯 My laptop had its first hard disk failure and I got lucky in the fact that I was able to back up most of my data…(scorched3d gave me an I/O error tho) 😥 But other than that all is well now, I have a new hard disk (FUJITSU), double the size of my old one…which has been taken apart.

    Also, my router died too recently, so got a new one, faster and better, and i figured out, that most of the hardware (HP) is incompatible with XP, so I am stuck with Vista…but i turned off Aero permanently and I am seeing how Vista is running wayyy better than XP (performance related).

    I have also doubled my Video card memory through an option in the BIOS, (think it is 128, it was 64 when I visited). and I will see how it affects scorched.

    Every problem i caused with the registry and firewall is gone and I am restoring my laptop’s software to the way it was…except, of course the software that I deem played a part in the hard disk failure.

    #51714

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    Hard drive crash bad. Computer working better good. Have fun restoring all your programs. 🙂

    #51715

    Rommel
    Participant

    Your use of the term hard drive failure has me a little perplexed. There is only one type of hard drive failure that I can recall being caused by software. That nasty little piece of code was designed to burn out the seek (head positioning) motor of attacked drives by doing rapid and continous seeks. This requires a very long and run time to be detrimental and makes it very easy to detect and halt prior to causing any damage. @Stil^^8 wrote:

    😯 😯 My laptop had its first hard disk failure and I got lucky in the fact that I was able to back up most of my data…(scorched3d gave me an I/O error tho) 😥 But other than that all is well now, I have a new hard disk (FUJITSU), double the size of my old one…which has been taken apart.

    Also, my router died too recently, so got a new one, faster and better, and i figured out, that most of the hardware (HP) is incompatible with XP, so I am stuck with Vista…but i turned off Aero permanently and I am seeing how Vista is running wayyy better than XP (performance related).

    I have also doubled my Video card memory through an option in the BIOS, (think it is 128, it was 64 when I visited). and I will see how it affects scorched.

    Every problem i caused with the registry and firewall is gone and I am restoring my laptop’s software to the way it was…except, of course the software that I deem played a part in the hard disk failure.

    However, regardless of what caused the problem, it would be nice if you would provide the rest of the information. Perhaps you can save someone else from the same fate. Even better would be to learn that the suspect code was not the problem after all. Not that I hope your HD problems were self inflicted, but if so, that type of thing is fairly easy to prevent. 😉

    If you have the HD open in a non-dust-free enviroment it would be best not to trust it even if you get it working again. If you can get it to read, I’d recommend that you do an immediate back up of the remaining data, bash it with a big hammer and then toss it in the trash. AOL CD’s are much better for mobiles than HD platters and they give off pretty colors. I love all the pretty colors.

    #51716

    PeanutsRevenge
    Participant

    Uh, hard drives die Rommel.
    Thats what they do.
    Everything that has a beginning, has an end Neo.

    the MTBF (mean time between failure) of most hard drives is around 50,000 hours. which is over 5 years of constant use, but thats under ideal conditions.

    #51717

    Stil8
    Participant

    Erm, mine, I don’t know the exact cause…first, I carried my laptop to school through the winter, so it experienced very big thermal changes, from 20*C to -20*C, at a very qick rate.

    This, I believe damaged the connection between the internal wireless network adaper, which stopped working in around March. I found out that if:

    1. The computer was heated up.
    2. The computer received somewhat strong physical shock in the area where the adapter was.

    The adapter would turn on, until the next time I put the computer to sleep, hibernate or shutdown. I refused to take the laptop back to HP, because they had already replaced the entire motherboard for the same problem in september 2007.

    I also was afraid for my computer, so I stopped hitting it, and left it constantly (24/7) turned on…no sleep, rarely restarted, etc… So the wireless remained on.
    I also created a power plan that had a very low processor rate and a disabled sleep mode. I only switched the laptop to this power plan, when I was not using it. I made it to minimize any overheating, or stress to the hardware.

    After a few weeks of this system the computer started failing to load up stuff and locking up at times, forcing me to reboot, then all went well until these repeated 2-3 days later.

    One day it did the same thing, I rebooted, Windows did not load…all it did was just sit there at the loading screen…I waited over 10 minutes and booted into safe mode and saw that everything should be alright, so I tried to boot back at normal startup, it waited about 5-10 minutes, and then it gave a blue-screen for a millisecond and rebooted.

    Thats where my luck changed…HP add a Recovery Partition (compressed files containing installation data for the OS and factory setup) And Recovery Manager, the program that uses it…How it works is:
    1. Reformats the C: drive (where the OS is)
    2. Reinstalls WIndows
    3. Reinstalls the same data and programs that the laptop had when it was bought. (Norton, Office 2007 are just examples)

    I found out that Recovery Manager could access the hard disk and launch CMD. It is able to run on an incomplete OS. (It creates a third drive “X:” and installs an incomplete windows-like OS on it, just enough so that the hard disk could be accessed.)

    I was able to backup most of my data, where some of it, mostly data that i can easily find again on my other computers, or the internet, gave me an error of this kind when I tried to copy it to the USB flash drive, burn to CD or even copy to a new folder: “The operation could not be performed because of an I/O error.” .
    After a bit of research, I learned that I/O is something about Hard Disk connections, and I still don’t know exactly what it is all about.

    I then was able to “Recover to factory condition” and found out that my network adapter worked now, when the computer was not heated up. And I didn’t have to hit it either, but I had to start the PC when it was cold.

    About 30 minutes later the computer froze up when I tried to copy back the backed-up data, and I was back where I started. I then knew this was now indefinitely a dying hard disk.

    I was told by BestBuy’s GeekSquad that this was a hard disk failure and I had to buy a new hard disk, as everything on the laptop, but the motherboard was out of HP warranty.

    After my sister helped me find my FUJITSU disk, I installed Vista successfully from a recovery DVD HP sent me…it created a recovery partition too.

    So I found out that the network adapter wouldn’t turn on no matter what, so me and my sister bought a USB trendnet adapter [b/g/n], which is working just fine.

    (A bit earlier the D-Link router burnt out after a power surge…during a 5gb file transfer through it, so We bought a new one from Linksys…[b/g/n])

    So this is where I am now, I know not to hit my laptop ever again, I know now to minimize exposure to drastic changes in temperature and to take care of my laptop from now on.

    Phew…that was long. ](*,)

    #51718

    Thrax
    Participant

    @peanutsrevenge wrote:

    Uh, hard drives die Rommel.
    Thats what they do.
    Everything that has a beginning, has an end Neo.

    the MTBF (mean time between failure) of most hard drives is around
    50,000 hours. which is over 5 years of constant use, but thats under
    ideal conditions.

    And since MTBF is an Average.. some drives break down much sooner,
    and these one’s I salvaged from Spring-Cleanup keep going after much
    longer.

    #51719

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    Always keep a linux live cd for such emergencies. Also if your drive is not working right and you cant copy stuff off of it. As a last resort pop it out put it in a plastic bag in the freezer for about an hour then connect it to another computer and pull the info off it.

    Oh and backups are very important. That reminds me I need to go check mine.

    #51720

    Stil8
    Participant

    @irishbandit wrote:

    As a last resort pop it out put it in a plastic bag in the freezer for about an hour then connect it to another computer and pull the info off it.

    Didn’t think of that…it is a very risky option tho…it could worsen the sutuation, rather than help. That hard disk is also crap right now since I took it apart to see what it looks like in the inside, and I don’t really care as to what happens to it now.

    I don’t know about Linux, but i also know now to make backups more frequently.

    I am also curious, as I haven’t tried this before:
    If I install windows XP on a hard disk (any hard disk) then put the hard disk in a USB enclosure so that it can be used as an external hard disk, and set a different computer than the one it was installed from to boot out of that hard disk, will XP boot, or not?

    #51721

    Thrax
    Participant

    @Stil^^8 wrote:

    I am also curious, as I haven’t tried this before:
    If I install windows XP on a hard disk (any hard disk) then put the hard
    disk in a USB enclosure so that it can be used as an external hard disk,
    and set a different computer than the one it was installed from to boot
    out of that hard disk, will XP boot, or not?

    No, it likely wont. Xp always installs with the drivers and all configured
    for the first computer. If too many devices change at once, it think’s it’s
    been hijacked and gets pissed off… either triggering it’s own lock-out,
    or trying to use the wrong motherboard/hdd drivers and getting
    scrambled to bits. Most commonly, it won’t even get past the ntldr,
    since the system volume information doesn’t match the pc it started on.

    #51722

    Stil8
    Participant

    So what you are saying is that XP can be booted from an external drive, as long as it was installed on that drive from the computer that it is to be run on, and that the computer is compatible with XP.
    That was what I was looking for in the answer, ’cause I heard linux can do it, but no one I’ve asked so far (in rl) has heard of it being done with windows.

    Thx 🙂

    #51723

    Deathstryker
    Participant

    I have also doubled my Video card memory through an option in the BIOS, (think it is 128, it was 64 when I visited). and I will see how it affects scorched.

    Better make sure that it’s 128 because setting this to the incorrect setting may affect performance.

    Also, about the installing XP on a external drive, it’s not made to do that but here’s a site that shows you how with some extreme rigging.

    http://www.ngine.de/index.jsp?pageid=4176

    The only problems with this is that 1) whatever system you use it on, it must support bootable USB and 2) it may simply not work despite rigging it to do so because windows ties it’s installation to things like the type of motherboard and BIOS to prevent it from simply being moved from one computer to the next. Even if it did boot up, it’s likely that you might have to reactivate XP again. And 3) if you get past all that, you’d have to install drivers for whatever system you run it on which may or may not be covered in Windows generic drivers (definitely not if running on a newer system).

    #51724

    PeanutsRevenge
    Participant

    Thrax: Thats why its called MEAN TIME and why I said under ideal curcumstances and big, rapid changes in tempterature are certainly not ideal, especially that low (they don’t like going below 0C).

    Stil: Sounds like bad sectors, the drive will still be usable (as u found) but some parts will result in HUGE hangs and failer to write/read the drive.
    I/O means input / output, its the typical uninformative error that windows likes to throw up. Doesnt give any reason for the failiar, just says it failed.
    Could be a faulty cable, head, platter, sector, power supply, anything.

    Linux live CD/DVD’s are great for those problems, will load a fully working operating system from the disk, allowing the user to copy data and/or access the net for drivers / solutions to problems, but there are a few windows versions, the one I have is bootPE I think. Not a patch on the linux version, but thats windows for ya.
    The only way it can worsen the situation is to compound the previous read/write problem, but there is usually enough head room to use this. Worst case, would cost a TINY bit more o recover the data from a specialist (which is already in the thousand(s) of dallars anyway.

    If trying to boot an installation of windows on a machine other than the one it was installed on, the secind most likely case is that the new drivers will be required.
    Almost definately windows will require re-activation, which will not work online, only over the phone and if you let them know that copy has been removed from the previous machine (the license is for use on ONE PC at a time, unless it was sold pre-installed on a system, in which case the license is for that machine only (including upgrades).

    The majority of the time, when beating the hell out of a PC (with the power off) nothing will happen.
    Occasionally a component / cable will get slightly disconnected, requiring a lil shove back into place.
    If the power is on, it is the hard drive / cd/dvd that can become damage as the insainely rapid spinning is disturbed causing the platter or disk to touch something that is spinning at a differnt speed or is static, thus scratching the surface.

    As you will have seen Stil, the platters on a hard drive are VERY much like a cd / dvd / Vinyl record in operation. The difference is that the platters hold magnetic charges, whereas vinyl has physical dents and cd/dvds have reflective/non reflective ‘bents’.
    the phsical motion is almost identical… a spinning disk with an arm to read/write the disk. They are either already touching or VERY VERY VERY close to it. Should that action be disturved and the two come into contact, you get a scratch. That is probably what happened to your drive, SOME parts of it are scratched, so cannot be read/written to reliably.

    Should you continue to transport your laptop to and from school, I suggest that during such time you leave it on standby.
    This will mean the laptop is slightly on and giving off heat into its bag, keeping it from ver low temps.
    However, it will also mean the hard drive is in standby too, meaning the arm (the read/write bit) is parked and cannot harm the disk.
    Should this be done with windows ON, its likely the disk will be active during transportation and given M$s love for constantly reading the disk for the idiotic fun of it, its very likely damage will be done.

    This is how these new TOUGHbooks work, which claim to be shock resistant.
    They realise they are moving at a speed that is dangerous, thus put the head (read/write arm) into the park position to the side of the platter, avoiding damage.

    #51725

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    If linux is not your thing. You can always try bartpe
    “Bart’s PE Builder helps you build a bootable Window CD-Rom or DVD from Windows XP or Windows Server 2003 very suitable for PC maintenance tasks.

    Bart’s PE Builder will give you a complete Win32 environment with network support, a graphical user interface (800×600) and FAT/NTFS/CDFS filesystem support. Very handy for burn-in testing systems with no OS, rescuing files to a network share, virus scan and so on.” Will also let you copy files to usb.

    If you need to work on some ones computer its a life saver.

    See http://www.softpedia.com/get/System/Back-Up-and-Recovery/Barts-PE-Builder.shtml

    The main site appears to be down right now.
    http://www.nu2.nu/pebuilder/

    #51726

    Stil8
    Participant

    @deathstryker wrote:

    I have also doubled my Video card memory through an option in the BIOS, (think it is 128, it was 64 when I visited). and I will see how it affects scorched.

    Better make sure that it’s 128 because setting this to the incorrect setting may affect performance.

    Yup…system information says 128mb of Video memory.

    #51727

    sylvester2612
    Participant

    Try http://www.diskemergency.com where you recover your data easily. You just submit your problem online and get the job done in short time.

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