This topic contains 51 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  Laptops Daddy 9 years, 5 months ago.

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  • #6492

    pastor of muppets
    Participant

    First suggestion let’s knock down round wins to 75 instead of 100 I have seen ppl kill like crazy and lose cus someone else was not considered a threat and they got the round wins.

    Second suggestion why not make round wins a “push” when no one wins round? Like in blackjack next round winner wins two rounds. I have seen many times when no one wins round and no one gets points for the round win. Why not push it over to next round and winner gets both rounds if this is possible.

    #51573

    PeanutsRevenge
    Participant

    Some people go for the round wins and try to pick up the odd kill, they do this by being defensive. Some people go for sure kills to earn money, then save till the later rounds.

    As for the rollover, that would be horrible IMO, would mean that someone could take a huge lead especially a little later in the game when they can afford force shields or teleports etc, could end up gaining 300 points.
    I like close fights with many players, not watching someone march off with the win.

    #51574

    naka
    Participant

    @pastor of muppets wrote:

    First suggestion let’s knock down round wins to 75 instead of 100 I have seen ppl kill like crazy and lose cus someone else was not considered a threat and they got the round wins.

    I asked that before, i think 1round=2.5kills is more fair than 1roundwin=3.3kills.
    In the FFA games it is very hard to get >2 kills in the round.

    Other way of thinking is: if you have 12 kills and 2 rounds – winning the game is uncertain. 2 round wins aren’t enough.

    #51575

    Deathbal
    Participant

    I understand your point about 100 for a round win. I personally think people should be more aware and not let someone run away with the game. But lowering it a bit wouldn’t be that bad either. It all depends on what you want the focus to be. Winning rounds or kills. Or mixing them.

    Your second point interests me. But in a different situation. When 2 or 3 people win a round, I’d like to see the points split up. If it’s 100 for a round win and 2 people live, 50 each. With three, 33 each, and so on.

    Your carry over idea can get ugly. I think it would promote the use of dirt.

    #51576

    BigBear
    Participant

    I’m with Naka on what would be a good balance regarding points given for kills/wins. Previously I even wanted to make it 2 kills = 1 win, but maby 2.5 is more balanced.

    As for the carry over idea I’d have to join the ranks of those that think it could get ugly. Round wins are rewarded with too many points as it is AND are too much dependant on positioning as opposed to pure skill in many games IMO. That a stroke of luck should give you an even higher reward sits badly with me.

    #51577

    pastor of muppets
    Participant

    Yeah I agree that the carry over would make it uneven. I never really thought about it until you guys brought it up. I do like the idea of spreading the points out between the round winners. I just hate seeing no round winner at all after a couple or few ppl survive 12 shots.

    #51578

    Rommel
    Participant

    Hi POM:

    It sounds like the mass killer you described lost the game because they got greedy and didn’t play defensivly enough to survive the rounds required to earn a game win. It’s a simple concept but since several seem to have missed it, here it is again:

    The single most important aspect of the game is to survive the round.

    Instead of changing the game to conform to the uninformed, I propose that we attempt to educate them.

    Apoc Champions used a ratio of 10 kills = 1 round win (kill = 25, win = 250) in an attempt to promote thinking over assisted shooting.

    @pastor of muppets wrote:

    First suggestion let’s knock down round wins to 75 instead of 100 I have seen ppl kill like crazy and lose cus someone else was not considered a threat and they got the round wins.

    The object was to try to make the game more like war and less like the target practice option. Unless you could kill 12 players (including yourself) with one shot, it was nearly impossible to make a self kill pay off. The only exception that comes to mind would be takiing out the leader with you as the last player able to effect a stop.

    Hopefully it’s easy to see that letting someone else kill you, just so you can get one more kill, would be a huge mistake with round wins being so valuable.

    @pastor of muppets wrote:

    Second suggestion why not make round wins a “push” when no one wins round? Like in blackjack next round winner wins two rounds. I have seen many times when no one wins round and no one gets points for the round win. Why not push it over to next round and winner gets both rounds if this is possible.

    You must be thinking about Jacks or Better – Progressive. In Black Jack every hand is a new bet, the bet doesn’t double.

    No win – no points. Seems fair.
    Single winner – all points. Seems fair.
    Mutiple winners – spilt the pot. This seems fair as well.

    How about some bonus items?

    First to lock in their shot – 50 points
    Last to lock in or failure to lock in – Minus 50 points.
    Killing the leader – 50 points.

      ADMIN ALERT :


    A few players have been disconnecting with impunity. If they find themselves in a position where they are a sure kill, they wait for their opponent to lock in their shot and then they disconnect. Not only does this cheat the remaining opponent out of a sure kill, it also causes them to waste a shot that could have been used on someone else.
    Hog you later,

    Rommel

    #51579

    PeanutsRevenge
    Participant

    @rommel wrote:

    Hi POM:

    It sounds like the mass killer you described lost the game because they got greedy and didn’t play defensivly enough to survive the rounds required to earn a game win. It’s a simple concept but since several seem to have missed it, here it is again:

    The single most important aspect of the game is to survive the round.

    Instead of changing the game to conform to the uninformed, I propose that we attempt to educate them.
    Rommel

    Great idea Rommel, let’s educate.

    Firsly take no advice from Rommel on how to win rounds / games.

    Heres the stats (that we talking about)

    Rank|Name |Kills| RW | GW| Time
    3 |Huckleberry |3241|1176|95 |26d 23h 36m 50s

    17 |Peanut’s Revenge|1706| 481 |71 |8d 12h 33m 17s

    So, Rommel has:

    120 Kills per day
    43.5 Round wins per day
    3.5 Game wins per day

    I have:

    200.7 Kills per day
    56.5 Round wins per day
    8.35 Game wins per day

    I am an average regular player that does not dirt and usually goes for the sure kill, but I have more round wins per day and more than double the game wins.

    So, maybe hiding like a girl doesnt work that well for getting wins.

    If you dont kill your enemies, then there are far more of them to kill you.
    If they are dead, its hard for them to kill you.

    In conclusion, kill, or be killed.

    #51580

    bazzz
    Participant

    What were you saying to me about winning before PR?

    And what about my favorite mod rom?Will i see it again sometime?

    #51581

    Deathbal
    Participant

    @rommel wrote:

      ADMIN ALERT :


    A few players have been disconnecting with impunity. If they find themselves in a position where they are a sure kill, they wait for their opponent to lock in their shot and then they disconnect. Not only does this cheat the remaining opponent out of a sure kill, it also causes them to waste a shot that could have been used on someone else.
    Hog you later,

    Rommel

    Do they rejoin the game or do they stay disconnected?

    #51582

    Rommel
    Participant

    Hi Peanut’s Revenge:

    @peanutsrevenge wrote:

    Great idea Rommel, let’s educate.

    Firsly take no advice from Rommel on how to win rounds / games.

    It would please me tremedously if you would be the first to take me on in the one on one contest that Trat proposed eariler. It seems that in spite of all the chin music that has been posted, there are no true warriors that are up to the task.

    Before I go, I realize that Trat’s challange was not possible and won’t hold you to the requirement that you must win every round. For you and me, the final scores will be fine. The World Series option (best 4 out of 7) sounds good to me. So, what say ye now old bean, do you have what it takes or don’t you?

    Sincerely Yours,

    Rommel

    #51583

    Rommel
    Participant

    Hi bazzz:

    @bazzz wrote:

    What were you saying to me about winning before PR?

    And what about my favorite mod rom?Will i see it again sometime?

    Although I’ve been devoting the majority of my free time to playing on the Advanced FFA server, I am still playing around with the Apocalypse Extreme mod (I love all the pretty colors). If you have any ideas that you think would help to prevent cheating please let me know. The gravity changes, map sizes, short shot timer, etc., don’t appear to provide any protection at all from the aimbots, although they do seem to be good deterents to grid users and square counters.

    As you may recall, my original objective was to create a target rich enviroment where honest players could shoot in confidence that they were playing against other players shooting honestly. When the bot was revealed and there was no interest in trying to prevent it, I shelved my hopes of running an honest game and there they still remain.

    If there is anyone that would be willing to divulge the information on how long it takes to plot a shot using the aimbot(s), I would be most apprecitive. My shot clock is currently set at 25 seconds. This is sufficient time to get off a shot if you are shooting by eye but is it also sufficient time to plot a shot with the bot?

    So, will you see it again sometime? I sure hope so.

    Best Wishes,

    Rommel

    #51584

    bazzz
    Participant

    Good to hear you are still working on it. Im not too worried personally about cheaters ,as said its someting thats hard to prevent in an open source game,even in commercial games like gunbound there are aimbots. Its a possibility we have to accept or change the essence of what this game is, any security can be circumvented anyway.
    The short shot time is good imo but i doubt it will prevent bot users.If it shows the projectile traject real time it probably takes less time anyway to plan the shot.C`est la vie,we can only catch the clumsy cheaters the ones that are good at it you`ll never notice.

    So is that a reason not to play this game,of course not, same as that life is worth living despite all its risks.As long as we dont let our fun be spoiled by cheaters we will be better off living and playing the game.

    #51585

    PeanutsRevenge
    Participant

    MCB Server ok with you Rommel?

    BTW, I was not trying to say that I am better than you (the gameplay speaks for itself), I was simply pointing out that burying oneself alive in your own crap does not work for main spokes person of dirt and showed some evidence to back up my point.

    For the mod and shortening the shot time, I fully believe Bazz to be right that an aimbot would vastly descrease the time required as there would be less of the, plus 6, no, 10, left 3, maybe 3.5 as you look at the shot from various angles before firing.

    I think the only way to find out what does and does not effect the bot is to download and try it.
    I dont where to get it from and do not want people to think that I am cheating.

    Bazz….
    I believe the discussion was about the NEED to win to enjoy the game.
    I enjoy the game whether I win or lose generally. Having just gone through (at least, I hope im through it) a very bad patch lasting a few weeks, I think I can honestly say that I do not HAVE to win to continue playing like some people do (they admit it themselves so no need for me to say).

    #51586

    Thrax
    Participant

    @peanutsrevenge wrote:

    MCB Server ok with you Rommel?
    -snip-
    For the mod and shortening the shot time, I fully believe Bazz to be right
    that an aimbot would vastly descrease the time required as there would
    be less of the, plus 6, no, 10, left 3, maybe 3.5 as you look at the shot
    from various angles before firing.

    I think the only way to find out what does and does not effect the bot is
    to download and try it.
    I dont where to get it from and do not want people to think that I am cheating.

    Most Mods are already remade to be immune to the known aimbots, so
    the whole thing is a moot-point for anywhere worth playing.

    Is it worth getting yourself banned for trying? when you already know
    it’s useless?

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