This topic contains 49 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  Laptops Daddy 7 years, 5 months ago.

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  • #53796

    Laptops Daddy
    Participant

    that does sound a bit ridiculous

    Then when you have a leader of a state (Saddam) sending 25k to families of suicide bombers, how do we stop him? Just tell him to stop?

    25k what? did you mean money?**

    you cant mean 25 thousand dollars? i must be reading that wrong. we could probably have paid every family in both countries 25k each in their money for less than the war has cost so far.

    **ohh… i googled. fox “news” http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,48822,00.html

    what kind of condition would people have to be in to give up their lives so their family could have 25k dollars?

    id think youd have to be pretty p’ssd off to want to kill your enemies by killing yourself. would money really make a difference? 25k doesnt buy much. maybe a reasonably priced family car? that’s not much of a legacy.

    pretend money makes a difference and 25k US to a family in Palestine really is worth dying for. (im not sure it is – it might be in parts of Afghanistan, but that’s a different conflict). why not spend some of the cash we spent on the war effort in Iraq helping those people out?

    not that id expect the fox news audience to know palestine from barack osama (or a muslim from a tourist in a tea towel) (hope no one really watches that junk!)… but i guess the why is because the USA are too friendly with Israel and dont dare step in. (that, and, the war in Iraq wasnt about the Palestine/Israel thing anyway either).

    i think we should all try to filter out the nonsense in news reports. even the legit news channels are biased.

    it looks like viking has a nice system.

    #53797

    Raden
    Participant

    wow, so many points of argument, but all viewed from one side, the western side, which unfortunately seems to mainly be, the USA’s side. What gives one country the right to meddle in other countries affairs?
    As far as i remember, Iraq was a sovereign state, only declared and imposed on with the title non sovereign state by a few and by the powerful, those whose words carry weight inside the UN and also those who ‘make’ most of the ‘world’s policies’. Why impose sanctions on a country?? why make the people of that country suffer more?…to punish the government of that country? not a good idea..
    These people breaking the law, breaking sanctions and laws made by outsiders, just so that they can sustain their ailing economy, just so that they can still feel like they are living, living free, in their own country, which i think was much better off then, than now ..
    @deathbal wrote:

    You can’t have an attack like 9/11 occur and just wave it away to poverty and frustration. Some message has to be sent. In this case two countries have been upended.

    Thats because you have the means and financial clout to send a message. so what does the poor man do, when his country cannot fight a war or battle, the way you envision a war should be…guerilla warfare, guerilla tactics…hit and run style, suicide bombings, attacks on specific high profile targets…. hmmm sounds familiar..almost seems like what a terrorist would do.

    I wouldn’t place the blame solely on the governments of the US of A, but the cronies, the guys who follow behind, I dunno why, maybe out of fear of an economic backlash or some other sort of ‘punishment’ for not toeing the line, they are also to be blamed. Or maybe they are in it just for the fun of it, knowing that they can easily win this battle and that battle, because they have so much superior firepower and logistics, typical bullies , i should say, going against someone whom you know can never fight back or give a good fight. So the battles are won, but who won the war? did the outcome of this all made afghans and iraqis live in a better place?? I feel that i hear some ‘yes’ and imagine some ‘nods’ and ‘noddings’, oh just because I saw it on CNN, on CNBC oh, there’s BBC, yeah, those people look all right, the reports on these channels show they are happy. …hmmm, have a look on al-Jazeera please, learn to see 2 sides of an argument and then come to a conclusion…

    everybody, every country has the right to run their own country as how they like it, and sooner or later, the despots and the dictators will fall, by the hands of their own people, revolutions have happened countless of times, without the instigation and interference of outside influence.

    Talking about terrorism, …what you all see and fear, and hate and condemn, is only the by-product. The cause, is so much deeper than you can imagine, and I doubt that you can imagine it because you are all looking at it from the only way that you can imagine. You have to know history, the history of the middle-east circa 1940-50’s. Personally, I believe, it goes well beyond this period, conspiracy theories and all, whatever you may like to call it, but there is an agenda, by a powerful group, to control it all 😉 however, going that deep and that far into history is not worthwhile for me. it will only turn out to be a never ending argument over a very difficult subject. So alternatively, I give you all a letter, a letter which was written by a King, of a middle eastern country, a letter which he wrote, so many many years ago, as a plea, to all those that are in power, to understand the graveness of the implication of what those in ‘power’ has clearly decided to do.

    As a result of certain biasness in decision making and policies made by those in ‘power’ in the subsequent years after this letter was written, so much hatred has cumulated, so borne out of all this is terrorism or JIHADISTS or islamic militants as YOU all call it (jihadists is a very funny term imo, really, it shows the lack of knowledge and the narrow mindedness of those that coined it up and use it frequently)
    If you have honestly read this letter thoroughly, then I hope an iota of realization hits you, if not more than that. Have some empathy if not sympathy for those that we misunderstand out of our ignorance.

    One man’s terrorist, is another man’s freedom fighter….open your eyes and see the real terrorist, the one that is no freedom fighter at all, but the one that is driven by greed, to create havoc wherever he wishes to, for his own benefit, without due regard for others.

    #53798

    Viking62
    Participant

    *If you do not have an Office program to read raden’ document download-Here is a free program (open source) ➡ http://download.openoffice.org/


    @ LD & Raden- Very well put! Due to the inadequate means to hear & see the truthful/unbiased news here in the U.S.A.;very few have the correct knowledge to debate world events and they do not even realize that fact.

    Edited/trimmed

    #53799

    Deathbal
    Participant

    @comedown wrote:

    Since when were the suicide bombers from Iraq? #-o

    Talk about lapping up any ridiculous excuse that someone throws out in the media…

    Nowhere in my post did I say the suicide bombers were from Iraq. Just the head of state.

    #53800

    Deathbal
    Participant

    @raden wrote:

    What gives one country the right to meddle in other countries affairs?

    I’m not going to sit here and defend the whole Iraq fiasco, but I will try to answer your question. Unfortunetly it will be with another question.

    At what point do we hold countries responsible for those that work within their borders? I’m not speaking of Iraq, just in general. What options does a country have if they are attacked? Especially if it is gorilla warfare where no country claims responsibility. People have to originate from somewhere. How do you propose we fight this?

    #53801

    Laptops Daddy
    Participant

    good post, raden.

    @Rden wrote:

    going that deep and that far into history is not worthwhile for me. it will only turn out to be a never ending argument over a very difficult subject.

    i love a bit of history. it’s a big can of worms though, right?

    im almost afraid to touch on the gaza strip. ive read a load of stuff about the conflict, ive watched video interviews with Palestinian and Israeli leaders, ive talked to Jewish people who have family in Israel. i still feel like i know nothing.

    i think it’s quite natural for people to want to stick up for the little guy. palestinians are dealing with some bad stuff.

    i read that letter. it’s interesting. im a bit of a sceptic, and i doubt its authenticity. the letter seems to be cited all over the internet in various blogs, and even appears on netanyahu’s website with a rebuttal (bible quotes “Thou, O Lord… find favour in Thy sight” and some other king james style bible bs).

    did kings of countries write to magazines in the 1940’s?

    im imagining Hussein writing in person about iraq’s wmd’s. im sure it would do a lot for a magazines credibility, but it wouldnt happen in this era, and i doubt it would have been much different in 1947. (i could be wrong).

    i think this is the same King Abdullah who was assassinated by an annoyed palestinian in 1952 for being a bit too cosy with the new Israel?

    anyway, assume it’s genuine. the author makes some good points:

    Italians might claim England, which the Romans held so long. England might claim France, “homeland” of the conquering Normans. And the French Normans might claim Norway, where their ancestors originated. And incidentally, we Arabs might claim Spain, which we held for 700 years.

    at what stage should Palestinians be seen to be doing the same? isreal’s population already exceeds palestines (i think).

    it worries me that muslims in some parts of the world still see europe as “the christian west”. most wars have religion in their roots somewhere. europe isnt the christian west – europe (certainly the UK, germany and the other main players) has long since moved on from links between predominant religious groups and national identity.

    @raden wrote:

    These people breaking the law, breaking sanctions and laws made by outsiders, just so that they can sustain their ailing economy, just so that they can still feel like they are living, living free, in their own country…

    these were the bases that allowed for the rise of nationalism in germany in the 1930’s. that’s also worrying.

    history does seem to repeat itself. everyone should study history, but i think people should also study contemporary society.

    the world isnt fair, but we’re not at a stage anymore where wars over national identity or religion arent avoidable. anyone who uses the internet in the same way we all do (ie, a quick chat about the weather with a buddy in India, or Malaysia, America or any other), will realise quickly that we’re all exactly the same, muslim, godless or otherwise.

    i think most people do recognise how flimsy these barriers are in this century. all these wars are wars about wars, it seems to me. it’s about time we all got with the times and mixed a little.

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