This topic contains 62 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  Deathbal 10 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #37718

    BOY
    Participant

    @irishbandit wrote:

    So my question still stands are there people who really count squares in the game??? Can it be proved will it be proved?

    Side note does resigning effect your skill ranking?? If it doesn’t i think it should. Or have some type of penalty like taking some of the players score off.

    Vihor admits to using it, Demi did, judas did, several other use it for no winds I think.

    for the tournament, resigns did give negative points. 😉

    #37719

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    @boy wrote:

    @irishbandit wrote:

    So my question still stands are there people who really count squares in the game??? Can it be proved will it be proved?

    Side note does resigning effect your skill ranking?? If it doesn’t i think it should. Or have some type of penalty like taking some of the players score off.

    Vihor admits to using it, Demi did, judas did, several other use it for no winds I think.

    for the tournament, resigns did give negative points. 😉

    OK now my question is how do you count all them freaking little squares??? I tried counting some and in 35 seconds i could not get a very good number.

    @boy wrote:

    for the tournament, resigns did give negative points. 😉

    Yay will this become a new feature on main?

    #37720

    vihor
    Participant

    1. just warn: we are lost great Demimurych !

    2. please carefully with words “cheater” and “cheating”

    3. many players have problem: how applied “ctrl g” grid, and how counting square? (big difference between human and animal …)

    4. sorry kids, life is cruel

    5. in war all resources are allowable (trust me, im survive one)

    6. finally in sport exist pros and amateurs leagues/results

    #37721

    HWB
    Participant

    I think grid user is not a cheat. I feel the grid user summcummed to the darkside.

    The Light side is so much better. 😀

    #37722

    Spectrum
    Participant

    i VOTED NO! Frankly the only form of cheating i consider wrong is hacking the game to get the upper hand in it, ie messing with the code so the hacker always wins; which tahnkfully is not the case with this game. If any/all/some members of the community waant to use this method, or others, to improve there game THAN MORE POWER TO THEM and MY GOD HELP THOSE OF US WHO DON’T!

    #37723

    Panther30
    Participant

    actually, spectrum, shotzo is doing just that…

    #37724

    Shotzo
    Participant

    I don’t always win you know…

    I would if I knew C++.NET really, REALLY well, and physics, and how to implement a 3 dimensional runge-kutta method for approximating trajectories.

    even then, it takes a supercomputer to figure out what power, angle, and rotation would result in a hit. (1000 * 90 * 360… * 100 steps per shot…. and this has to be done within a certain time limit. And the only way to do this QUICKLY is to have an analytical equation that has all the possible variables for the shot, wind, wind direction, gravity, rotation, elevation, power)

    As you can see, the processing power necessary to always hit, always on the first try, is immense…

    Now just try doing this wheneevr the aiming indication (when you press ‘a’) moves.. .. up to 40 times per second (frame rate.)

    CLEARLY I am not able to cheat in the manner you all SEEM to WANT to believe that I am ‘cheating’ in. It’s impossible. PLAIN and SIMPLE.

    (No, I don’t have a million-dollar supercomputer.)

    #37725

    Laptops Daddy
    Participant

    The balance has changed since I last checked (was 2:1 yes before).

    @boy wrote:

    I hate to pull a cbx here, but your poll is wrong.

    What’dyou mean my poll is wrong. : o How rude.

    @vihor wrote:

    2. please carefully with words “cheater” and “cheating”

    I pleased very carefully. Even checked a dictionary. : )

    I still haven’t heard any real arguments (‘cept Boy and BB, but that’s not the kind I mean). Are we saying that it is cheating, but that it’s allowed anyway?

    To anyone who doesn’t think it’s cheating. Please consider this hyperpathetical situation:

    You’re at your local pub playing pool (possibly drinking orange juice if you’re under 18 ). The 8 ball’s the last one on the table and it’s your opponents turn. Suddenly, your opponent pulls out a notepad and starts studying it. In this pad he has meticulous details of every dent, scratch, knot and cigarette burn in the tables frame, along with positions of bar stools, bar maids, the lot.

    He steps back a bit, scratches his head and while studying his notes, pulls out a calculator. He then improvises a protractor out of a cue and the markings on the table and using his notes, lines up the exact angle he needs to make the shot… and wins the game.

    Did he cheat? How about if you had money riding on the game? What if you’d only bet that money ‘cause you knew you could beat him?

    @irishbandit wrote:

    So my question still stands are there people who really count squares in the game??? Can it be proved will it be proved?

    How about adding a server option [allow grid]?

    Anyway, more no votes than I expected so far. Looks fairly even. (Though surely if even half the people think it’s cheating, something should be changed.)

    Can we leave the poll open for while?

    Ps:
    There are trophies?

    #37726

    cbx550f
    Participant

    I just now saw this topic – what a mix of good posts and offtopic stuff! lol

    Anyway…
    @laptops Daddy wrote:

    The balance has changed since I last checked (was 2:1 yes before).

    @boy wrote:

    I hate to pull a cbx here, but your poll is wrong.

    What’dyou mean my poll is wrong. : o How rude.

    Actually, I thought his poll was sufficiently succinct.

    @Lappy wrote:

    @vihor wrote:

    2. please carefully with words “cheater” and “cheating”

    I pleased very carefully. Even checked a dictionary. : )

    I do think that this is a very good point. It appears that “Counting Squares” is somewhat common, at least, and if it is decreed that it is cheating, whomever has used it is not a cheater, IMO. They may have been using a practice that is “now” considered cheating, but they were not at the time. (Just my opinion ;))

    I still haven’t heard any real arguments (‘cept Boy and BB, but that’s not the kind I mean). Are we saying that it is cheating, but that it’s allowed anyway?

    Well, I’d say that if it’s allowed, it’s not cheating. Q.E.D.

    @Lappy makes a good analogy, and I like analogies. This is what he wrote:

    To anyone who doesn’t think it’s cheating. Please consider this hyperpathetical situation:

    You’re at your local pub playing pool (possibly drinking orange juice if you’re under 18 ). The 8 ball’s the last one on the table and it’s your opponents turn. Suddenly, your opponent pulls out a notepad and starts studying it. In this pad he has meticulous details of every dent, scratch, knot and cigarette burn in the tables frame, along with positions of bar stools, bar maids, the lot.

    He steps back a bit, scratches his head and while studying his notes, pulls out a calculator. He then improvises a protractor out of a cue and the markings on the table and using his notes, lines up the exact angle he needs to make the shot… and wins the game.

    Did he cheat? How about if you had money riding on the game? What if you’d only bet that money ‘cause you knew you could beat him?

    Good analogy, except for one thing: What if he only had 35 seconds in which to make his shot?

    To me, if someone can make measurements and calculations (or look up values in tables, whatever) within the allotted time, either the allotted time is too much, or they are THAT fast at it (in which case they should be ALLOWED to use their skill. Say it were me, and I could make wicked calculations in my head – should that be disallowed? If so, should guys who can just look at it and figure it out too well be disallowed?

    Anyway, to get back to the analogy: My answer is, “No. So long as he wasn’t taking an excessively long time.” 😉
    Would it be irritating? Yes.
    But so long as he made his moves in about the same time as me, I wouldn’t see a problem.

    @irishbandit wrote:

    So my question still stands are there people who really count squares in the game??? Can it be proved will it be proved?

    How about adding a server option [allow grid]?

    1. I really don’t know for certain, but I would imagine that there are more than a few.
    2. Might be a good idea.

    Anyway, more no votes than I expected so far. Looks fairly even. (Though surely if even half the people think it’s cheating, something should be changed.)

    I have yet to vote, actually. 😉
    Second point: I’ll think on that a bit.

    Can we leave the poll open for while?

    No.

    Well, okay. 😛

    #37727

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    I have not voted yet either 😆 😆

    nice posts guys i like the part about only having 35 seconds to shoot cbx

    #37728

    Viking62
    Participant

    😯 I do not think using your brain is a form of cheating. On the other hand;using a automated form of aquiring targets/kills would be cheating. My aimbot has died recently-lol (lack of time spent playing;lost my groove). I’ve used my hand to span 2nd shots on my screen & from playing the game i can sometimes judge in 25 shot power increments,following with my cursor. So my assumption would be that if we cannot think or use what works for us-how would we play the game?
    Use what works for you-instinct shootin,grid shootin,hand spanning,rulers,
    or just good judgement. If you want your life to be controlled & structured; play checkers. A very competitive group here! Dont call someone a cheater just because they use tactics that are beyond your scope and/or ability. Vihor-I’m in aw every time I play you–Keep it up 😉
    I Apologize for any undesired overtones–I came back & edited my post.
    And in answer to L/D-I voted-Thread is mute pt. sound like politicians. 🙄

    #37729

    Laptops Daddy
    Participant

    Time for another comment (‘cause it’s my thread).

    @cbx550f wrote:

    Good analogy, except for one thing… …But so long as he made his moves in about the same time as me, I wouldn’t see a problem.

    That’s a fair argument and assuming it’s possible to do that kind of thing quickly, you have a point. But I don’t think the time constraint argument stands up so well outside of the analogy.

    In Scorched, 35 seconds is ample time to count as many squares as necessary, especially if you’re using a customised warp grid or similar. And you don’t need a protractor in Scorched; you just dial in the angles.

    Using the word cheat:

    I take Vihor’s point. The word does imply dishonesty. I apologise if these connotations are hard to swallow, but that’s kind of the point.

    Language is clumsy (‘specially when it’s mine) and I think we need to keep this in context. This is just a game and cheating or otherwise, it’s only for fun.

    Sometimes, when I want to aim a laser, I turn off the land, grab the nearest thing with a long straight edge ; ] and use it to extend the top of my pink aiming triangle. Works like a charm. But is it cheating? (I think so).

    Another analogy – Card Counting in a Casino:

    Card counting takes a lot of practice and a lot of skill. The card counters aren’t using any special tools and the methods are available to anyone. Is it cheating? (The casinos seem to think so).

    @cbx550f wrote:

    …wicked calculations in my head – should that be disallowed? If so, should guys who can just look at it and figure it out too well be disallowed?

    Good question. I’ve been accused of cheating several times. (I’m JUST THAT GOOD (‘cept in the mornings : )).

    Say you’re on a roll. Every shot you make hits first time, wind or not. Don’t you think the whole square counting thing mars that achievement? I mean, someone hits first time and instead of people thinking “Wow (s)he’s good”, they think “Bet they’re coun…”.

    Sorry, tangent.

    Any more?

    Ps: Viking62, Are you saying you’re for or against?

    #37730

    hobbesme
    Participant

    @irishbandit wrote:

    Side note does resigning effect your skill ranking?? If it doesn’t i think it should. Or have some type of penalty like taking some of the players score off.

    Hey now! No need for this topic to get all crazy & controversial! Resigning never hurt anyone!

    Sissies.

    😛 🙂

    #37731

    hobbesme
    Participant

    @laptops Daddy wrote:

    Please consider this hyperpathetical situation:
    You’re at your local pub playing pool … your opponent pulls out a notepad and starts studying it. In this pad he has meticulous details of every dent, scratch, knot and cigarette burn in the tables frame, along with positions of bar stools, bar maids, the lot. He steps back a bit, scratches his head and while studying his notes, pulls out a calculator. He then improvises a protractor out of a cue and the markings on the table and using his notes, lines up the exact angle he needs to make the shot… and wins the game.

    First of all, if this were to ever happen, the opponent in question would either have his ass laughed off or beaten up. Not because he’s cheating, but because in the context of bar billiards, this would be the sissiest form of cheating ever witnessed.

    But it would NOT be cheating since players already do this in their head — what difference does it make if one’s notes are physically written down versus mentally retained?

    As cbx said, if he wasn’t beaten up or laughed out of town, then kudos & congratulations to him if he can do all of this within a reasonable time frame.

    @laptops Daddy wrote:

    Another analogy – Card Counting in a Casino:
    Card counting takes a lot of practice and a lot of skill. The card counters aren’t using any special tools and the methods are available to anyone. Is it cheating? (The casinos seem to think so).

    Card counting is an expected skill & requirement for most serious card players & card games. This analogy is bogus since casinos are businesses whose primary interest is to provide entertainment that generates profit, NOT provide a venue for skilled or actual gameplay.

    #37732

    InductiveOne
    Participant

    I didn’t realize this had come up so many times before, went back read some of the old stuff, got bored. Realized something important though. Nobody will come to any conclusions here, everyone already has a set idea. So… Is there any real point in arguing? Everyone seems to have slightly bizare arguments from both sides anyway.

    I say lets just get to playing 🙂 If people are winning way more then everyone else in a game, well, at least you know who to aim at.

    I apoligize for posting earlier too hehe, if I knew this was an eternal thread I would have skipped it.

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