This topic contains 29 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  Thrax 7 years, 6 months ago.

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  • #4926

    BOY
    Participant

    Thrax, Bobirov and myself were lamenting the limitations with the free market recently.

    I originally made several feature requests on this issue and others like communist economy here.

    The basic idea is to get more creative with the free market. It seems the current system gets the prices up or down and they stick there. The adjustable factor only limits how slow or fast they get stuck.

    would be nice to see

    • ability to exclute items from the free market with special tag (perhaps useful for necessities like missiles and parachutes)
    • a way to increase the max price increase percentage (currently limited to 150%)
    #34898

    imported_gcamp
    Participant

    The way the freemarket is this :-

    When a player buys a weapon –
    – a list of other weapons in the same price bracket is chosen.
    – the cost of the weapons in the this bracket falls by money spent/no weapons in bracket
    – the cost ot the weapon bought rises by money spent/no weapons in bracket

    What’s meant to happen is the weapons all reach a point where their price/performance factor is equal for all weapons. i.e. for the money every weapon is equaly as useful.

    However, people seem to have favourites that they buy regardless of the price so the whole thing falls down. So I had to set limits to stop say the Funky from becoming $1M. Because of this most favourite weapons just reach their upper limits and then stay there.

    #34899

    Thrax
    Participant

    @gcamp wrote:

    The way the freemarket is this :-

    When a player buys a weapon –
    – a list of other weapons in the same price bracket is chosen.
    – the cost of the weapons in the this bracket falls by money spent/no
    weapons in bracket
    – the cost ot the weapon bought rises by money spent/no weapons in
    bracket

    What’s meant to happen is the weapons all reach a point where their
    price/performance factor is equal for all weapons. i.e. for the money
    every weapon is equaly as useful.

    However, people seem to have favourites that they buy regardless of the
    price so the whole thing falls down. So I had to set limits to stop say the
    Funky from becoming $1M. Because of this most favourite weapons just
    reach their upper limits and then stay there.

    And for most areas, it works as it is intended.
    We keep an eye on what weapons are used more, and those prices rise.
    However with only 150% cap, it can’t really make the price of an item
    become unappealing.

    The reason Funky’s are so popular isn’t thier pretty color, it’s that
    they Kill multiple players in strong shields, For a very low price.

    Unlocking the limit to a Higher level, say 200-300, should let something
    rise to an undesirable point. Players are encouraged to explore
    alternatives or blow all thier earnings on that one weapon.

    It would never reach a million, since only Ebo has been able to get
    that high.. It would probably level off at 25-30k.

    #34900

    Deathstryker
    Participant

    I consider myself a smart shopper. I’d never pay 1 mil for a funky… What a ripoff.

    I agree with what Thrax is saying, btw. I think the game would be much more interesting if the Free Market had more of an effect. Besides, anyone who didn’t like this can always play with EconomyNone.

    One thing I’ve been wondering in Scorched 3D is if you are able to accumulate money when prices are low like in the original (haven’t noticed):

    @Scorched Earth Manual wrote:

    Although you must usually accept a loss when you sell something back, if
    you are playing with the Free Market switch on, it is possible to
    accumulate money if you buy low and sell high…

    I guess it would be though since the sell price raises too.

    #34901

    cbx550f
    Participant

    I’ve always thought “throw the cap in the harbour”. 😉

    Let Funkies go WAY up, let chutes co way up – I’d like to see this happen for a while and see what people REALLY think items are worth!

    I remember one night a few months back, I happened to buy a nuke on one of my first buys (a weapon I rarely use), and I did alright with it… I wound up using nukes excluseively all night – I single-handedly raised the price a LOT. lol
    It was fun, and with the crowd that was there, and the general habits of people at the time, it was effective, until the price got out of control. I love the freemarket – it fixes imbalances itself. Well, exempting those which are capped.

    Question: It looks at items in the same price bracket, you mean per bundle, right? And does that transcend types? (ie: if 2 force shields are about 30k, and a DH is about 30k, does buying 10 DHs lower the price of the Force Shield?

    Wait, what do I care? my mod has no buy! 😛

    #34902

    BOY
    Participant

    what is the range in a price bracket? The number of weapons in a price bracket becomes rather imortant to the free market i guess.

    As far as parachutes go, falling down is sorta a normal thing. Parachutes really are needed. Wouldn’t want them to be sky high, but I dont mind an increase. The parachute price jumped alot when the market applied to defense but nobody blinked 😛

    #34903

    Brain Damage
    Participant

    @boy wrote:

    The parachute price jumped alot when the market applied to defense but nobody blinked 😛

    weird, i do have the complete opposite feeling
    people do complain about chute’s prices, they just do in the game, not on the forums; also if you can see now people try to save on chutes money so they are chuteless up to 4-5th round (average)…

    #34904

    Thrax
    Participant

    @Brain Damage wrote:

    @boy wrote:

    The parachute price jumped alot when the market applied
    to defense but nobody blinked 😛

    weird, i do have the complete opposite feeling
    people do complain about chute’s prices, they just do in the game, not on
    the forums; also if you can see now people try to save on chutes money
    so they are chuteless up to 4-5th round (average)…

    Hence, the request for a tag for prices. To have them ignored
    by the Free market.

    Some items that are critical can be bypassed, applying the freemarket
    to the weapons and shields that actually are overused.

    or simply cut the base price for chutes.
    300% of 5k is less than they are costing now on the beginner servers

    #34905

    BOY
    Participant

    a base price cut would make the unnecessary in the case of chutes. No big deal really. However, the could still be handy for setting up clever buying schemes.

    An idea could both lock and unlock the freemarket price, is to have this optional tag:

    #

    where the maximum allowable cost = (base price)*(#)

    and the minimum = (base price)/(#)

    where # is an integer >/= 0 where 0 excludes the item from any free market bracket completely, 1 locks the price only, and the default value of 2 (ie. 200% or -50%)

    – a list of other weapons in the same price bracket is chosen.

    Gavin
    how are the current price brackets determined? what is the range? Is bundle size accounted for?

    raising the free market price caps gives a possibility that weapons will actually jump into other price brackets. What about the idea of splitting the weapons into classes instead, for example:

    1. shoot-missile (missiles, mirvs, dirt)
    2. shoot-special (burn, roll, laser)
    3. shoot-aim (funky, sandhog, digger)
    4. defense & move

    #34906

    Deathstryker
    Participant

    This topic got me thinking about a new market type similar to free market.

    What if we had a market based more directly on skill? Have the prices raise based on the lethality of a weapon. If someone kills with a certain weapon, have that weapon raise in price.

    Also, BOY, can you add a POLL to this thread covering the options we’ve discussed so far?

    #34907

    BOY
    Participant

    *bump*
    @deathstryker wrote:

    This topic got me thinking about a new market type similar to free market.

    What if we had a market based more directly on skill? Have the prices raise based on the lethality of a weapon. If someone kills with a certain weapon, have that weapon raise in price.

    Also, BOY, can you add a POLL to this thread covering the options we’ve discussed so far?

    I’ve been waiting for an answer my question about the price brackets… sigh. have wondered for a while if I really wanted a poll like you said, but I don’t think it will help though. I’m sure that cbx will not have the option he wants 😛

    #34908

    BOY
    Participant

    *BUMP 2*

    Still need an answer about how the free market price brackets are determined.

    #34909

    imported_gcamp
    Participant

    @boy wrote:

    Gavin
    how are the current price brackets determined? what is the range? Is bundle size accounted for?

    Accessories are choosen that are
    1) of the same type (e.g. weapon, defense)
    2) Cost less than the person currently has
    3) Cost more than 30% of the bought weapon
    4) Cost less than 175% of the bought weapon

    Bundle size is not accounted for. As buying the weapon is not an option if you cannot buy a whole bundle. But perhaps the price should change based on the bundle size.

    #34910

    BOY
    Participant

    the cogs in my head are making lots of noise but I can’t tell what it means, Ill post something tomorrow. 🙂

    #34911

    Hiroyuki
    Participant

    How about setting a certain amount of weapons per game available in server – and set the price of these items relative of the server inventory? hence increasing the prices of high-demand weapons (low availability = high prices), and weapons that are in low demands get really low prices… eventually, if people buy the weapons when the prices are really high, the server might run out… maybe with a slow reaccumulation of weapons as a “production factor” – so and so many weapons produced per round. This favors the people that decide quickly which weapons they want, and is another way to add another competing factor to the game…

    just a thought of another way to do the dynamic weapons pricing…

    I am one of the great fans of this system of balancing the game; it really makes all weapons of the game usable.. and I believe there should be no caps on prices if we were to use the current system – as intentional, prices will fix at the right price vs. usefullness and then have minor fluxutation around this price…

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