This topic contains 62 replies, has 0 voices, and was last updated by  PeanutsRevenge 9 years, 10 months ago.

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  • #45646

    Wowbagger
    Participant

    i voted yes too, anything to speed up the game. 😀

    #45647

    The AI
    Participant

    I voted full knowing of the actions of delayed defence. I have played servers with it, it adds a “roll of the dice” feel to it all.

    Think of it like warding a blow, you don’t stay continuously in one stance, and you don’t use a counter stance until a blow is in progress. Comparing scorched to Tower Fechtbuch may seem odd, but I find it fitting. It also makes it seem like an action, instead of an option.

    I propose a testing ground for suggestions like this. Anybody willing?

    #45648

    BigBear
    Participant

    @parasti wrote:

    You say that as if it was something that is not possible already. That is how it works. The only difference is that the player has a chance to act immediately — and thus potentially speed up the game.

    Pardon my lack of ability to get my point across. I’ll revert to the position of “anything to speed the rounds up a bit”. I still don’t see any meaningful aspect of gameplay getting lost in the process in this case though.

    #45649

    Thrax
    Participant

    @bigbear wrote:

    @parasti wrote:

    You say that as if it was something that is not possible already. That is
    how it works. The only difference is that the player has a chance to act
    immediately — and thus potentially speed up the game.

    Pardon my lack of ability to get my point across. I’ll revert to the position
    of “anything to speed the rounds up a bit”. I still don’t see any meaningful
    aspect of gameplay getting lost in the process in this case though.

    Well, since the whole purpose of you all waiting till the last instant
    to raise shields, is simply to ‘fake-out’ the opponents.. you are losing
    nothing by activating this switch.

    If the system is going to only show shields when the plays are all
    counted in.. then no-one will really need to wait manually.

    The person taking the longest to fire.. would only be faking out himself,
    since he will be making the game tease him..

    The only thing it would lose, would be the other form of fake-out
    that Main-players would never have experienced.
    Switching from one form of shield to another; to ruin a laser-shot, etc..

    #45650

    The AI
    Participant

    The switch fake won’t come into play yet anyway until people learn the new laser proof game. Then anyway they most likely won’t have the cash.

    To top it off laser proof is a foreign word on mains.

    It all depends on how you play, some people won’t be effected, others will get a new aspect. Yet still others are most likely going to look at all of this, then go back to whatever mod they were playing.

    So it all depends on the play style of the general group, Not a lot of shield chicken is going on lately, or at least for the match I just left.

    #45651

    parasti
    Participant

    @bigbear wrote:

    Pardon my lack of ability to get my point across.

    Your point seemed clear to me. Obviously mine wasn’t.

    And no, I still haven’t voted yet. Lengthy discussions aside, where can this thing be tested?

    #45652

    Thrax
    Participant

    @parasti wrote:

    @bigbear wrote:

    Pardon my lack of ability to get my point across.

    Your point seemed clear to me. Obviously mine wasn’t.

    And no, I still haven’t voted yet. Lengthy discussions aside,
    where can this thing be tested?

    It will be difficult, owing to the main-server crowd’s fear of foriegn servers.
    I can set any one of the mod-servers to use it as i have in the
    past; but unless the main-servers try it, most players will not try.

    #45653

    Irishbandit
    Participant

    Why don’t you just turn on your shield wouldn’t that be fastest? Seems the showing the shields on is a feature not a bug.

    #45654

    parasti
    Participant

    @thrax wrote:

    I can set any one of the mod-servers to use it as i have in the past; but unless the main-servers try it, most players will not try.

    Could the official servers just switch to using it and then after a week or two we take another look at running this poll?

    #45655

    Thrax
    Participant

    @irishbandit wrote:

    Why don’t you just turn on your shield wouldn’t that be fastest? Seems the showing the shields on is a feature not a bug.

    Yes irish, it’s a feature. Gavin added a switch in v40.1 for Delayed
    Defensive, making it only display all players ‘new’ defences when the
    shots were all counted and fired.

    I have used this option before a few times, and it was quaint. But since
    my servers host mods with more than five shields, the switching fake-out
    was lamented.. and i returned them to prevoius.

    For mains, where the biggest surprise is to have a shield at all!.. then
    hiding the fact till the last moment is a thrill. If they want to still have
    thier thrill plus faster play-time.. the Option would help.

    #45656

    Laptops Daddy
    Participant

    @bigbear wrote:

    Out of curiosity naysayers, isn’t it just as much an added element to gameplay if you don’t know if someone is gonna put up a shield or not?

    no it isn’t. waiting ’til the last second isn’t an infallible method for hiding potential bubble use. i’ll often put on a bubble at say 10secs, estimating that most players will fumble to adjust within that time and potentially miss their shot entirely. but if you’re ready for it, you can adjust within half a second if you have to.

    i think the key is real time. i’m more than a nay, i’m a strong nay. the new flashing “have they moved yet” circles are plenty.

    why castrate the game for the sake of a few seconds? don’t you think the real time aspect is important?

    maybe we should all submit our next 200 moves by email, and cut out the shot timer completely. or better still, why not forget scorched, and go play astro-empires. : / (i’m being sarcastic)

    #45657

    Rommel
    Participant

    Where can it be tested? I’m glad you asked that question. I’m always happy to get in a free plug.

    @parasti wrote:

    @bigbear wrote:

    Pardon my lack of ability to get my point across.

    Your point seemed clear to me. Obviously mine wasn’t.

    And no, I still haven’t voted yet. Lengthy discussions aside, where can this thing be tested?

    Why at Apoc Champions of course. I’ve been running the server with delayed defenses since it first started up. Ask around, it works great.

    You see some poor soul, smoke rolling out of his tank, no shield, you think, what the heck, he’s mine. You line him up lock in your shot to toss an Acid Splash. Then you see it! He just popped up a big force shield and his health is up to 100. Your acid is coming back at you now along with one from him and you know you’re going to die …… NOOOOOO!

    Delayed Defenses isn’t meant for kids in short pants but when you think you are up to the a real game, give it a try.

    I must go get some coffee now. Krieg ohne Hass

    Sincerely,

    Generalfeldmarschall Erwin J. E. Rommel

    #45658

    BigBear
    Participant

    @lappy
    That is a quality of yours lappy, that you are one of those ppl that don’t need a blah blah tag since you deliver them in an unmistakable manner. I understand your arguments and I am not saying that they are bad or wrong, but I just do not see it that way. In addition I’d like to nominate the “castrating the game” line as THE overstatement of the year. 😛 At any rate as I see it there are two options. Either we try the setting for a week or so and resume the discussion at a later point, or we just skip it alltogether. I’d like to try it out, but lets just say that I won’t loose any sleep if things stay as they are.

    @thrax
    I realize that it’s rather futile, but since you keep blabbering bout ppl being “afraid” of the non official servers and/or mods I feel compelled to keep telling you that whatever the reason, it sure ain’t fear. Personally a big factor for selecting the server to play on is who is on it (I’d say that the ppl I have come to know on beginners/main are the main factor for keeping playing for so long). Having said that I have tried quite a few of the mods and I just don’t feel that they add something that I was missing to the extent that I would keep coming back to play them. That is not to say that they are bad, it’s just a reflection of my disposition and the reasons why I play the game.

    #45659

    Rommel
    Participant

    Thanks for this opportunity Big Bear. I’ve been wanting to say this for sometime…..

    @bigbear wrote:

    @thrax
    I realize that it’s rather futile, but since you keep blabbering bout ppl being “afraid” of the non official servers and/or mods I feel compelled to keep telling you that whatever the reason, it sure ain’t fear. Personally a big factor for selecting the server to play on is who is on it (I’d say that the ppl I have come to know on beginners/main are the main factor for keeping playing for so long). Having said that I have tried quite a few of the mods and I just don’t feel that they add something that I was missing to the extent that I would keep coming back to play them. That is not to say that they are bad, it’s just a reflection of my disposition and the reasons why I play the game.

    I’m not sure why people think might think that there is a security problem with the game, but it’s simply not true. If anyone has had a bonafide issue lately, please provide some evidence. The posts I’ve been seeing with unfounded and/or vague accusations that the core is not secure are not helpful to anyone, not me, not you, and especially not Gavin.

    It’s a no brainer people … the core gets what it expects or disregards the information coming in. Unless you are running an altered core, You have nothing to fear but the fearmongers themselves. Visit any server you like and run whatever mods you find entertaining. So far, there appear to be no complaints about a security hole that have been validated. If this be the case, there is no valid reason to worry about “malicious” servers or the mods they run. The only thing I see as a possible problem would be if you go into your game folders and start trying to run files with the extension: bat, com, exe, pif, etc.. It’s possible that a rouge server could intentionally have you download something harmful in the hopes that you might give it a try. NEVER haphazardly run executables that you don’t understand.

    That being said, I’ll try to have Apoc Champions back up with 5 maps this evening. If you aren’t too afraid, give it a try. The super bots won’t be ready but you can try the delayed defenses and see what you think.

    I must get back to work now. Krieg ohne Hass

    Sincerely,

    Generalfeldmarschall Erwin J. E. Rommel

    #45660

    The AI
    Participant

    To note, I hit the shield button and my fire button at the same time, in the last two seconds. So would delayed defence change the way I play? In no way at all, I will still fir in the last two seconds, because I am busing talking, and then aiming, so there won;t be any change in the way I play.

    For the “real time” argument, what real time? What part of Turn Based Strategy has the words “real time?” I could understand that if the “real time” aspect that shields can use could be exploited, allowing mods to have deeper defence layers, walls, placements and such, but you can’t, not to my knowledge. Also, what would scorched lose? the ability to predict a shot? you can play switch-chicken in mains, not enough shields, there is no laser proof or ‘brella to change to last second, lots of people don’t use shields at all. Now for instance, if a mod had some things that relied on batts beings “real time” that might be one thing. But this is mains we are talking about.

    For a testing server, if you don’t want to play apoc champs (you will miss some great game play if you chose not to) then why not take thrax’s offer? Have it named “OFFICIAL TEST SERVER” or something, then use it to test the latest debates on the table, like delayed defence and fog. Stick the word “official” in it, or give it an official icon so people will know that it has backing.

    So many people play scorched and go no farther, they don’t look on the forum, they don’t vote in the polls; so take it to them. Have a note in the MOTD saying what is being tested and where to comment, allowing more people to make more informed votes.

    For the anti-mod stick that is being thrown around, absolute pain. On all sides spite and friction can be seen. Lots of people seem to think that when someone talks about mods, they are referring to apoc, or an “insecure” host, or they have taken some side in some conflict and think it is their solemn duty not to play mods, claiming that they “play scorched to play scorched, not a mod.” Mods are what make most games, if a game is modable, mod it. What major games don’t have mods? Some games come stock with an editor, others have open end code, some use Xml for everything. Its like not painting a house, or messing with your Pc, it is almost an insult to the creator, to not expand, to not give it your own tilt. Think of the amount of fan fiction out there, what is a better compliment? Imitation is the best form of flattery. Old saying, the new one is: Expansion is the purest form of flattery.

    We all love this game, so lets thank it. There are posts uncounted asking for more features, what about a community mod? a culmination of what people want, mass polls to find out, asking other people on server. Gavin has done his job, he has made a game that we can’t stop playing. So lets do our job, and make it so his creation never ends. Not that many people played the beta, now we need to make up for it, look around at all of the things found. Think if we started looking deeper, and doing more. With the release just out the door, and an influx of people, what could be a better time?

    that was a long post, and a bit off topic, a split maybe?

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